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Grants, Tax Credits Going To The Wrong Place

May 15, 2013

To the Readers Forum: I recently visited the Gateway Station, downtown Jamestown. To some it would be a work of splendo....

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(43)

Amtrakpax

Dec-07-13 4:17 PM

Brace yourself if you fly. The American Airlines - US air merger will not directly effect Jamestown yet. It's got a government EAS program to keep it going. But what it will do is kill a lot of connections at other airports. Higher fares less service to small cities like Jamestown are on the way. Or it will be an other Dunkirk Airport. Maintained by us for the flying poor that own airplanes. By the way Amtrak just broke an other ridership record. Same old thing for 11 years now. Please don't try to travel by train during peak periods. You will be turned away.

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will1988

Jun-14-13 12:19 AM

ok how stupid is this upgrade an airport if the county is going to sell it is there anything better to put that money into such as a new rail system through jamestown ny make it into a amtrak secondary route to buffalo and albany update the highway on 86 which is worse than drive on the jamestown city streets or even put the money into the main chautauqua county airport off route 60 even though that would be a waste of time since they dont use it very much either or put that money into the parks system or upgrade celeron park and make it back into an amusement park once again

Dunkirk Airport Upgrades jamestown.ynn**** Chautauqua County continues to invest in the Dunkirk Airport even though the county may end up selling it. Like · · Unfollow Post · Share · Promote Lance likes this.

Lance Erickson Your right on with this William! 21 hours ago · Unlike · 1

William yea they like to sopend money on stupid stuff least they spent money on one good thing the train station

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Firebrand

May-18-13 7:11 AM

The sale of the Dunkirk Airport needs to be a referendum vote by the people of this county in an November election. As a proposition, it would remove the hot potato tossed from politicians to elected officials and gets to hot to handle, time is right, let our residents decide that pay the bill, as we are the only county in NYS that pays for 2 airports. I believe the Dunkirk Airport only caters to special interest on the backs of the countywide taxpayer. Funds should be redirected to the commercial airport in Jamestown. This has gone on for way to long. I support Carlaw on this.

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carlaw

May-18-13 5:29 AM

Yes Renaldo I did. Only to point out government waste with out benefit to economy. I too would love a modern European style, fast and dependable train system. Big cities are actually tearing down old train stations and building new ones to accommodate this. The old ones don't. Can we really call a fancy train museum a boost to the economy? Why do we keep pouring much more money into the Dunkirk Airport, another luxury item for a few rich people when the Jamestown Airport is the commercial airport that with more funds could provide cheaper and better service to all. The planes fly both ways. It's too hot in the south to golf. Our summer and fall months are beautiful etc. We need to focus on ways to boost our economy and create jobs before we fund luxury.

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FedUpL8ly

May-17-13 11:21 PM

KCW and others, you are all partially right. Railroads, as a whole, in the Northeast went bankrupt due to government regulation, demographics and higher state taxes. The Erie-Lackawanna, in addition to the aforementioned, was also affected by the Rt. 17 Expressway that ran parallel to the E-L by which the taxpayers subsidized the trucking industry. All of these factors had the E-L barely surviving until Hurricane Agnes in 1972 which put the final nail in the coffin, so to speak.

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Renaldo

May-17-13 2:08 PM

I think the development of AC helped the movement south too, one of the many reasons.

Carlaw, did you bring up the airport issue?? Haha. I'd rather have a modern passenger train system... maybe in 20-30 years.

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KCW007

May-17-13 1:32 PM

That's why I mentioned the business favorable "Right to work" labor atmosphere in the southern states Seadog. The heavily unionized condition of northeastern industry at the time was certainly a prime factor (among many) which drove major reinvestment $ to the business friendly south.

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Seadog

May-17-13 1:05 PM

KCW007 - The unions were also to blame. Crescent Tool headed south to pay minimum wage instead of the high wages earned by the workers.

Now, that is not a slam against unions, I worked there. Just stating a fact.

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KCW007

May-17-13 10:59 AM

BTW, they've just run a new rail spur off the old South Buffalo into that Canadian outfit's new factory on the old Bethlehem Steel plant cite in Lackawanna. They're making steel tubing fixtures for the natural gas fracking industry. Must be planning to make a lot of product if they need rail service. Last evening's TV news said they are taking applications for workers.

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KCW007

May-17-13 10:24 AM

The demise of local industry in the later 60's and 70's had very little, if anything at all, to do with the lack of rail service. Most directly it was the combination of obsolete product lines, tired plant infrastructure and an unwillingness to make the necessary capital reinvestment locally at a time when southern states were offering far better long term financial inducements; not the least of which was the bonus of a "Right to Work" labor atmosphere. Jamestown wasn't unique in what happened, just another mention in the much larger saga of the Northeast "rustbelt". The railroads had no problem in providing service to those southern industrial parks which were then being built.

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PhD1960

May-17-13 7:38 AM

RE: "Seadog May-15-13 8:22 AM" post. Last Saturday the US Postal Service sponsored a food collection for the hungry. WHY? SNAP (Food Stamps) has increased 64% since 2008. If Uncle Sugar is feeding everyone, why is the Post Office collecting food? For whom? Where is the collection stored? How is it distributed? Eligibility? The P.O. is going broke and it takes on "Feeding the Already Fed" as a project?

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PhD1960

May-17-13 7:28 AM

RE: "askwhy May-15-13 7:35 AM" post. Google "Potemkin Village". Just a bunch of empty facades. It seems that our gov't is manned exclusively by an army of Grigory Aleksandrovich Potemkins. How much longer can we last?

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carlaw

May-17-13 6:09 AM

This money should have gone to the Airport. If we do what needs to be done there we could actually accomplish something. We also need to stop dumping money into that big black hole Called the Dunkirk Airport. It only benefits a few in the 'Good Old Boy' network and does nothing for the county.

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Maddog80

May-17-13 4:23 AM

I think industry left because the cost of running a business in nys is significantly higher than it is everywhere else. I wish it was as easy as bringing in trains. No doubt trains would be a small incentive for a business that needs to bring in raw materials via the rail but I just think the money could have been better used for tax breaks or business start up loans

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will1988

May-17-13 2:06 AM

ha ha, i guess i did put choo choo oops lol... but whywhy do you think industry and businesses left??? we had lots of industry here up til 1970s when they stopped running trains,then everyone shut down and moved south or west for more train travel. we need more trains to create industry which includes passenger and cargo trains.thats what makes a city grow bring back the trains

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recycler

May-16-13 5:58 PM

I took a tour with a small group, and there were no businesses in there. And I disagree with the notion that trains bring businesses. We keep saying we have a large problem with welfare. This typically means people who are renters. Would you seriously want to do business in a city where people rent? At least with an area with more than 50-60% of it being homeowners, it shows people would be grounded and more than likely to stay on the job longer than a few weeks.

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ironyoozesfromyouryap

May-16-13 8:35 AM

Same criticisms the Ice Arena had, I'm sure.

It's old hat. I was there two months ago and saw a concert. It is a beautiful place; why did it take the letter writer so long to learn the details (about no commuter trains)? We can barely get any to go through Buffalo.

If I recall, it cost 14 million dollars. That's less than $1 per NYS citizen for ONE YEAR.

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FedUpL8ly

May-16-13 7:15 AM

All the people complaining about spending money restoring the train depot should derive a lot of consolation from the fact that "the money" was much better spent and a much smaller amount than what Obama has spent on his "green energy" fiascos. Or for that matter, it's a much smaller amount than what Obama has spent restoring mosques in foreign countries.

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copyman

May-16-13 7:07 AM

A person needs to get to Jamestown from NYC or Rochester to conduct some new business. Should I drive my 60k Lexus (fuel cost not an issue) or take the Prius.(50 MPG) or Fly because time is the issue. No, lets take a train which requires additional transportation at both ends. Now, tourists coming on the train means they have no money, cheap and most likely collecting benefits. You keep dreaming Amtrakpax about train service.

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HenryH

May-16-13 6:49 AM

For an economy to exist, there must be infrastructure. The Train Station may prove useful for the local economy. However, without entrepreneurs, there is no economy. Look at your facebook feed. How many of your friends were excited the Oliver Garden came to J'town? How many people are using J'town as a base for national or international business? Lots of people want jobs but few want to build an economy. So Seadog, what is your next business venture? I know AskWhy must be investing locally. How about the rest of you?

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carlaw

May-16-13 6:18 AM

Will great comment, but punctuation marks would make it easier to read. :)

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Maddog80

May-16-13 6:15 AM

Torn down because they were delapidated. New ones built with major govt money. Those are much bigger cities than Jamestown and have people that frequently commute between those cities. The govt should stop investing in things like historical buildings. If i am on a strict budget, should i got ou and buy some antique that i dont need and the spend copias amounts of money to fix it up just because i think its a piece of history? No! A road itself may be a money losing object but the people who live on the pay taxes, the gas to drive on them is taxed....therefore there is some offset. I just think Jamestown is full of useless buildings. If no one is flying in or out of Jamestown, what makes you think they will take a train? Until there is something truly attractive in this area, other than Lucy(whom this next generation knows and cares nothing about) no one will want to come here.

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Amtrakpax

May-16-13 4:44 AM

When the trains disappeared from Jamestown it was a different World. The World of 20 cent gas, not $4. Over half the income of intercity bus lines and passenger rail was the mail and packages. Which were put on trucks by the highway people. That got control of the Post Office and Federal Government. We're lucky to have such a wonderful building. Or someday we will have to do what cities in Maine, Illinois and other states are doing that is build new ones at ten times the cost. Like Rensselaer, Syracuse and now Rochester and Niagara Falls. All are planning NEW rail stations! You see the ones they have are now too small! And the very old ones? They were torn down years ago. Which proved to be NOT very smart at all.

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Amtrakpax

May-16-13 4:37 AM

Maddog 80..."No one rides choo choo trains anymore" Well making this statement proves how much you know about trains. Amtrak has been breaking ridership records for TEN YEARS! Maybe it's the $4 gas...have you noticed? Or the decline in air service to small towns like Jamestown. Jamestown's air service is on pretty thin ice. It would be there without the Government EAS program. The fly the empty commuter planes to Cleveland. Nor do I hear you wanting to save money by ripping up the massive country road system. A real loser. The fact is the building is doing what it's surpose to do. It's a new center for events, and better place for people to use the bus services. One more transportation industry that's a loser without government help. Just like the road in front of your house. Industry will come back when gas is $20 agallon. It will be too expensive to import everything anymore like we do today. With 20 million new drivers ayear in just China $20 gas will be here soon.

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Maddog80

May-16-13 4:18 AM

Hey will, I heard there is a new picture show this week down at the cinema. Did you listen to the baseball game last night? I heard Dimagio cracked a couple. Ma and Pa said if I help with the paper drive the weekend, they will buy me a new slide rule...........no one rides "choo choo" trains anymore!!! 4 people will get off that train every week....walk around downtown for an hour and then hop back on and never come back. Jamestown needs to stop thinking about tourism. We need industry! We need year round jobs and revenue streams! 86 million to tear it down???? Were they going to bubble wrap each chunk to save in storage?? Here is some cost savings....I will personally tear that place down stone by stone for a measly million dollars.

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